H2 Blockers (Tagamet, Pepcid, Zantac, Axid) (Page 30 of 52)

Well unfortunately i don't have a credit card, i am not even 18 yet, im 17. So i don't have any way of getting it over the net.. Would Mylanta work? lol.

well i give up. i took 4 pepcid AC pills, on an empty stomach, 2 hours before my first drink, and STILL had the same problems. oh well, maybe next time ill pop 10 pills!

im begginin to think its an allergy or sumit. maybe the pills just dont work for me.

i think ill just have to tolerate the embarassment of going red and forget about it. I still had a great night out despite looking like a freak in all the photos!

I stumbled across this site a few days ago, and gave Pepcid AC a try last night after work.  I probably had about 4 or 5 onces of Crown Royal on the rocks.  Still got a little red, but nothing crazy.  The Pepcid AC definately made a difference.   And there is no hangover today.  Sometimes even two drinks will give me a brutal hangover, which prevents me from drinking a drop for the 18 hours preceding me operating an aircraft.  Since I fly on Saturdays, I usually avoid any social event on Fridays - which kinda sucks.  Last night I had about 4  drinks worth of alcohol, and I am 100% instead of the 75% I'd expect.

That being said, I have been reading more about the cancer risks associated with acetaldehyde, and am a little concerned.  More reading is necessary, but for now I think it is safe to say that I am not going to be drinking very often until I understand the risk better.  Maybe some heavy drinking once every few weeks - but that is it. 

Thanks for the site - it has been very helpful.  I wish I had found it years ago when I was in University, but ohh well - I had a blast anyways.

PS: I'm 5'9", 160lbs, 1/2 Filipino - and now I am old enough to actually care about cancer risks compared over the joys of alcohol, at 32.

I've tried using a combination of 1 Claritin (10 mg) + 2 Pepcid AC Max (20 mg each).  That has worked well for me.  The most Pepcid I've ever taken is 60 mg.  I'm very concerned about taking more than that.  I know you're probably just kidding about taking 10 pills(!), but I don't think that's a good idea.  Don't give up just yet.  I've been messing with the Pepcid method for a couple of years now and it still seems like I'm experimenting to find the "right" combination.

Good luck to you.

-S

Hi folks,

thought I would clear up something in case anyone has is harbouring any misconceptions. The research does not show that Pepcid causes an elevation of acetaldehyde. So the increase risk of cancer is not from taking H2 blockers per se. The increased risk of cancer comes from increased alcohol consumption and therefore increased acetaldehyde production from the breakdown of the alcohol.  Just thought I would clear that up.

Takezou has hypothesized on some effects of the H2 blockers. Unfortunately, I have to say that is just pure speculation. When scientist test something, there is a basis for that test. If we just speculate, there could be a billion different hypotheses. E.g. 1) maybe the H2 blockers prevent cancer, 2) Maybe the H2 blockers convert acetaldehyde into a harmless substance, 3) Maybe H2 blockers react with alcohol to form harmless substace,etc etc...

My answer the Takezou's suggestions is that there is no evidence to show that H2 blockers would slow alcohol absorption. There is no basis for that suggestion at this time. Further, as I mentioned in my earlier posts, alcohol levels are similar if not slightly elevated with H2 blockers. If the drugs slowed absorption, then you would expect a decreased blood alcohol level. (Dipadova et al found that famotidine, or the beloved pepcid, has no influence on blood alcohol levels. This was also shown by Cassini in 1994. However Ranitidine, i.e. zantac, does slightly elevate blood alcohol). The fact that the H2 blockers work must be caused by something other than decreased alcohol absorption.

As to the 2nd question, as to acetaldehyde being broken down faster. Again, there is no evidence to show that happens. There is no known reaction between acetaldehyde and the H2 blockers per se, and thus no reason to support that hypothesis. Again, and as expected, the research done on H2 blockers show that there is no change in acetaldehyde levels after consumption of ethanol with ranitidine or famotidine. (Tanaka et al, 1988)

Now, the previous favourite hypothesis, as mentioned earlier is that, the H2 blockers inhibit the CONVERSION of alcohol to acetaldehyde. There is at least some basis for this hypothesis because Ranitidine is an inhibitor of alcohol dehydrogenase (the enzyme responsible for the conversion). Dipadova's research found that taking Ranitidine indeed does, to some extent, increase blood alcohol concentration, thus supporting the argument that alcohol breakdown is being slowed. BUT, famotidine, as mentioned above, was found to have no such effect. This is what leads me to believe that there is something else in play which makes Pepcid work. Note that Nemesanszky et al, in a 1996 review of all the evidence, opined that the effect on blood alcohol levels is only very small.

That's why I believe that it is possible that the H2 blockers perhaps work on the release of histamine. The flushing, shortness of breath etc are symptoms of histamine release. And acetaldehyde has been shown to cause histamine release in certain cells. But I state emphatically, the research has shown that neither ranitidine or famotidine decreases serum acetaldehyde. The citation for Tanaka's study is  Br J Clin Pharmacol. 1988 Jul;26(1):96-9.  You should be able to find it on Pubmed. In fact, the Tanaka study showed that Cimetidine, or Tagamet, could actually increase exposure to acetaldehyde (Area under curve for acetaldehyde was slightly elevated). Fortunately, i don't think Tagamet is all that popular here!

So again, please don't take pepcid or zantac as a licence to drink freely.

P.S. It is the result of the Dipadova study, which showed that ranitidine decreased first pass metabolism of alcohol, that makes the Zantac + Claritine combo my favourite. This is because I know that the ranitidine is at least slowing down acetaldehyde production in my blood to some degree. Hopefully giving some protection against it's ill effects. 

pps. the Dipadova citation is JAMA. 1992 Jan 1;267(1):83-6

Upon reading your reply, I realize that I had wrongly paraphrased you, an embarrasing and on top of it all, feeling hurting mechanism.  Unfortunately, we won't launch into a flame war, beacause I hereby profusely apologize for my actions.  I also apologize for those who wanted to see a flame war, but not profusely.

What I meant to say is that you suggest that for asian flushers, a night of pepcid ac fun probably comes with the same high level of acetaldehyde that the drinker would have if he drank the same amount without pepcid ac, and also that taking zantac instead of pepcid a/c may mean lower levels of acetaldehyde.

Such evidence would be enough to make me more inclined towards zantac, but with such great savior wannabes as Natifus, I wanted to see more.  Thus my devil's advocations of dream-come-true speculations to prompt you to further solidify your case.  To clarify, the speculation of the best case (if pepcid a/c  should break down acetaldehyde directly to prevent red face,) was not a hypothesis, (which should be an educated guess,) but simply a "please show me another thread of logic that rules out these border cases."

Basically, it wasn't a "I don't believe this guy", but more of a wikipedian "This article does not cite its sources."  I know that this forum is NOT wikipedia, but honestly, with so many people viewing this resource, it has a similar function and carries a similar responsibility.

I think that now that you do cite your sources and use them with improved logic to show the above "zantac may be better" argument, everything is clear.  Good job, and thanks for the work.

Here's my experience with Pepcid AC:

Just to let you all know, I'm not an experienced, frequent, or heavy drinker.

I'm 5'8", 145 lbs, 21y.o., 100% Chinese (half-Canto, half-ChaoZhou). I don't think my dad's side (Cantonese) flushes, but my mom's side (ChaoZhou) definitely flushes. I normally get the following symptoms:

- Flushing (pink color)
- Bloodshot eyes
- Increased heart rate
(Following are probably associated with the alcohol itself)
- Light-headedness
- Coughing (should be noted that I will also experience coughing after drinking a significant amount of soda -- significant being substituing all drinks with soda for a couple of days)
Intensity of symptoms appears to vary with which beer (Budweiser seems to be the worst, but I've only tried Budweiser, Heineken, and Tsingtao so far)
: Will also occasionally experience headache, drowsiness, and (slight) hangover with Budweiser (after 1 can)

I had a Hot Pocket and some Cheetos before starting this test. This is a timeline of what happened:

4:05pm    -    1x 10mg tablet Pepcid AC w/ some water
4:08pm    -    7oz cup of Swiss Iced Tea
5:05pm    -    Started drinking 12oz can Budweiser
5:10pm    -    No flush yet
5:15pm    -    No flush yet
    .    ..    -    Noticing slight increase in heart rate
5:20pm    -    Finished drinking 1st can
    .    ..    -    No flush yet
5:23pm    -    Heart rate appears normal, increase might have been due to going up and down steps
5:25pm    -    Cheeks appear slightly more rosey than normal
5:30pm    -    No significant change
5:35pm    -    No significant change
5:40pm    -    Face and ears getting slightly warmer (ears becoming more red)
5:45pm    -    No significant change

I stopped keeping track at this point because the symptoms weren't getting any worse. My ears were noticeably more red than my face. It's actually pretty hard to notice the redness on my face because my skin will actually appear to tan more (up to a point, where it will start progressing towards pink) if I flush/blush. I didn't experience any bloodshot eyes and only felt the onset of light-headedness and coughing (both of which dissappeared pretty early on). I got the Pepcid AC (original strength -- blue box) from my local supermarket. Cost was $10 for a 30pk. I plan on doing another test tomorrow (w/ more beers to figure out how much the Pepcid AC negates).

[Btw, the insert from my box of Pepcid AC says that you can use up to 2 tablets per 24 hour period. I'm not sure if the same applies to the other variants of Pepcid, but it's probably something people want to watch out for.]

hey guys,
after finding this place i ordered a bottle of generic famotidine from ebay, and about 5 10mg pills would greatly reduce my reddening. before that, i had tried zantac on its own, to little success. but upon hearing about some others having luck with the zantac + claritine combo, i went out and got a pack of zantac extra strength (300mg ranitidine) and had one of those with a claritine about an hour before starting to drink. I've just had 2 beers over the course of an hour and i'm pleased to report that i'm only very slightly red without the usual throbbing in my head. just the nice buzz that i long to have without the aid of pharmaceuticals. normally my hands would also go very red, but not this time!

in the past i've also tried 5 famotidine tabs + 1 claritine which seemed to be more effective than the famo on its own.

make of this what you will, and just fyi, i'm a 5'5" vietnamese male, 23 years, 60kg, your regular puny asian guy :)

cheers.

what drink would be the best to drink?? rum? teqila? vodkas? etc?

Yo Takezou, no no no... pls don't apologise. I didn't mean to sound angry or to "flame"... If anything, my statement was meant to be academic and "debate" like. Nothing personal.  We are all here for the same reason, to find a safe, effective way to get round the curse of the flush. The problem with typing in forums is that there is no "tone" to the statements. Picture me saying the same thing with a smile!

If you are ever in Singapore, let me buy you a drink (and some zantac-claritine)!

And to all the Chinese out there, Happy Lunar New Year! Drink smart!

hi,
Im 19 and from NZ. im half asian and drink like a tank, every weekend ill get completly wrecked and also suffer from asian glow. i found a good system that works for me, i drink about half a dozen drinks to get tipsy and red, but if i stop for about one hour my face will return to normal and im sweet for the rest of the night. also if i skoll to make myself throw up before really hitting the piss im sweet. but i will be sure to try pepcid.

hey does pepcid make you not feel sick?!